So I have been sick for almost a week now and in that time I have watched a lot of television and caught up on a lot of things I have been meaning to watch. One of which was Ryan Gingrich’s show on RFD TV. I think I have mentioned on this blog before that his show is more of a blood lust thing for me. I would never, ever give him a horse of mine to train, but did used to tune in to see at what point this guy was going to get himself killed. I couldn’t even site through all the episodes I had recorded because they irked me so much, so my blood lust is gone and his show is off my DVR for good now. One trend I did notice was that almost all of the owner’s were over-mounted.
What does that mean? Well, It means that, you are mounted on a horse that is too much horse for your ability and experience and beyond your skill to ride well. And while it seems like an easy concept it is actually something that people have a very hard time spotting themselves. The key part of the definition is the phrase is that the horse is beyond your experience and ability to ride well. There is a huge difference between being over-mounted, and loosing your nerve. Yes, the can both have disastrous ends, but being over-mounted means that you never had the ability end the situation, while loosing your nerve means you have the ability but something mental is getting in your way.
I know that there are several blogs that I read where the person is over-mounted and doesn’t seem to realize it. I am not calling anyone out, in fact I don’t think these people would even think that they are over-mounted. I can also think of one where there is a loss of nerve (and this person is really working hard on this issue). If you look back on my posts you can see that when I first started leasing Texas I had a loss of nerve. I guess the best way to describe the subtle, yet very important difference is through this scenario…
You are riding a horse and working at the canter. The horse is getting tired and you can tell they are getting crabby and don’t want to be working anymore. You keep pushing and make them canter more when all of a sudden they go up into a rear.
The person with a loss of nerve knows to lean forward, open the inside rein a touch to try and get the horse off balance just enough so they go back to earth, and to already start to plan how they are going to get the horse to go forward when they get all four feet on the ground. Not that they always do it, but that could do it if they think about it.
The over-mounted person feels the horse go up into the air and clings on for dear life. They don’t know what to do, they just know they would like the rearing to stop.
Does that make it more clear? Now both of these things can lead to serious injury to the rider. An over-mounted person can ruin a horse for life and make it so that no one can ride them, where as a person who looses their nerve tends to just avoid the issues, which is not great either, but the horse is likely to be able to be re-trained. So how does this happen? Well, it happens rather easily and I will give you three of the most common situations.
A typical situation is green horse/green rider. Green Rider’s tend to not realize how much horses cost and think that they are “saving money” by purchasing a green horse. What they do not realize is that horses are not born knowing how to be ridden, we have to teach them and if you don’t know what you are doing it is going to take a lot of time and money to fix the mistakes that you have created. Trust me, if you are new to riding and you want to buy a horse you need to spend the money and get a horse that is very well trained, and over 10 who has been everywhere and done everything.
Another typical situation is the, “But I always wanted a ____ horse”. Fill in the blank with any color or breed. I know that I am a color idiot myself so I understand where those people come from. They will over look a lot because they have stars in their eyes. They might know that a horse has a bucking issue, but they figure that either (A)The horse will suddenly stop doing it when they own them (B) They can learn how ride through that…how hard could it be? or (C) They have always wanted this color/breed so they will do whatever it takes to make it work.
The other thing that I have seen a lot is what makes me really angry. A trainer nudging someone to get a horse because all they can see is dollar signs. The owner will pay them lots of money to ride the horse for them since they don’t know what they are doing, and on top of that they will get to charge the owner even more money by making them take lessons on a lesson horse. It breaks my heart to see so many people paying full training board on their own horses and also paying to take lessons on their trainers horse because the trainer pushed them into a sale that was not a good fit. Trainer’s often get commission on sales so they might always have the best judgement.
What Can You Do About Being Over-Mounted?
So you think you are over-mounted. What you need to do is stop riding or working with the horse as soon as possible. Bring it to a professional training facility and get them to train and sell your horse for you. The training is not going to be a quick fix so don’t expect to just pay for someone to ride your horse for 3 months and have all your issues disappear. You also need to make sure that the trainer you work with has a good reputation and treats horses well. You are probably not going to get a good future owner to come out and look at a horse at a barn that is known for cruel methods and poor horsemanship. You as the owner bought a horse that was too much for you and the horse should not be punished any further because of your mistakes.
You also should start taking lessons yourself right away on a variety of more experianced horses. You are not going to learn as well on a green horse as you well on a horse who knows what you are asking. And horses generally pick up on bad habits from humans so there is a good chance your horse learned the bad habit from you, so you need to take the time and make sure it does not happen again.
So you don’t want to sell the horse? I can understand that since I myself am terrible at the whole letting go thing. What you need to do is still stop ridding and hand the reins to a professional, and also get yourself some lessons, but there is something else. You need to talk over your fears and issues with someone. If every time you ride the horse spooks in the same place your body will learn to tense right before that happens. That means that even though you are paying all this money for your mistakes to go away they wont because your body has taken over its response. So you need to mentally be able to separate that old horse from the same horse with the new training on it. And that is going to take a lot of time and money.
So my best advise? If you think a horse is too much for you it probably is. Simple at that. And if you find yourself having an inordinate number of accidents, you have an issue. And if you are only riding one horse and that one horse happens to get you out of the saddle more then 10 times in a single year, you are most likely over-mounted. So stay safe and be careful. Remember, riding is supposed to be fun!
I am not a professional, this is just one persons opinion. I just hate watching good horses get ruined. Anyone out there have anything else to add? Do you agree or disagree? Are there other ways to handle being over-mounted?
Really, really excellent post! The really sad thing is that the horse owned by the person who is over-mounted is suffering too – it isn’t getting the direction and confidence it needs from its rider – who is too inexperienced or afraid to keep riding when things happen. I came originally from a part of the horse world largely populated with TBs and TB crosses (hunter/jumper), and there were many, many people who were over-mounted but didn’t always know it – who believed that they were skilled riders because they could get on a horse that had been ridden by their trainer all week and then lunged to death at the horse show and go in a ring and win ribbons.
Figuring out that you are over-mounted isn’t a character flaw or a moral failing, either. People need not to feel bad about themselves if their experience and riding wishes don’t happen to match the horse they own. There are ways to fix it as you point out – just letting it go on doesn’t do horse or rider any good. It takes time and experience to learn to deal with these issues.
A year ago I probably wouldn’t have agreed with you about people being over-mounted but now, yep.
Two years ago we bought a 4 year old horse for my 9 year old daughter on the advice of our then trainer. My daughter was always confident on him and is a good rider but she was 9. I’m not nearly as competent and he always made me nervous. After 4 months I realized our mistake and left the trainer but kept the horse.
The new trainer brought him along much better than we ever could on our own and we were hopeful things would be okay. He wasn’t spooky, had great ground manners, walked and trotted with the best of them but hated to lope.
Almost a year to the day we bought him we sold him. We now have a 12 year old been there done that horse that I truly trust not to do anything wrong with either of us in the saddle. Our steady Eddy.
So yes, I agree that there are many ways that someone can end up over-mounted and not always recognize it.
Great post. Over the years I have seen many over mounted riders. I can say I feel bad for the horses, they get punished for things that aren’t their fault…they just don’t know any better. I’ve got to agree with you on the whole trainer sells the horse to rider and then rides it and they take lessons on trainers horse scenario. It’s happened too many times to count and I think it’s unethical. Anything for a buck right? You’re right too, if you find yourself over mounted get off and take lessons. As a matter of fact you shouldn’t even buy a horse to ride until you’ve had enough lessons to know what to do with one if you get into bad situations.
I was definately over mounted when I bought my paint. He is such a cutie I had to have him. He was 3 1/2 and only had 30 days under saddle. I was a timid beginner / intermediate rider. I sent him straight to my best friend for training and I only rode him in lessons with her. It was a great experience to watch him grow and learn and to be a part of it. He was in training for 8 months. My paint is a great boy and really doesn’t do anything bad. I am not a trainer and when issues come up I am happy to let the trainer ride and address the issue and teach me what to do.
It might just be my background in rehab work coming through, but ……
If I am on a horse at the canter/ lope as in your scenario, and feel the horse getting tired, I’ll quit the faster gait before the rear happens. That doesn’t mean I’ll quit working them completely- but rather we’ll move onto something else, at a slower pace, that engages different parts of the body.
This is a great post OTB. Very nice job. Only advice I’d have for anyone is this:
Lessons lessons lessons.
With LOTS of people.
Ride as many different horses as possible.
Take more lessons through out your horse life, even if you have been riding for 20 years- just because you were doing it “That Way” for THAT LONG does not mean it is being done correctly!
Rubs to both Genny and Texas from me please, and get better soon girl!
Excellent post although I have to say, I was bucked off a horse (At First Instant aka Tuff) more than 10 times in 6 months…I wasnt over mounted..It was the horse. I had THREE trainers tell me. It was bad breeding (stubborn breeding) Beautiful horse great mover won the classes that we did, before he got his stamina up. And another horse of mine…I thought I was over mounted…turns out I wasnt it was the horse. When I leased him she was asking 5500 sent him back she was asking 10500 for him by the end of the year…she asked us if we would buy him for 3500 fancy TB he was beautiful grey…but he had that “eye” You know the eye that says you can do what you want with me but when Im done I mean I am done.. My trianer who trained OTTB’s said that that was his breeding and it would take years if it was possible to fix him and he was a horse that you could take out on a hack once a wk. Not ride and show compete. Which is what we were doing…Bye bye Tough Decisions aka Dekker!
I have a history of riding everyones “junk” that has made me who I am and I have learned what I can handle and retrain and what is just not possible and what I cant do. I ask advice when I know I dont know what to do and I take lessons. Green horse Green rider is doable…but its up to the Trainer to recognize and say when the rider cant handle something and help out.
LOL, good post! I have seen all that you describe over the years. There is an old saying that goes, “green + green = black and blue”. Yep, that one tends to be true, also. Sometimes, even experience isn’t a safety net as I found out with my new horse.
But one thing experience partnered with a modest ego will get you is knowing the right moment to seek the help of someone who has more experience in a particular field than you. Instead of forging ahead and tackling the problem yourself, the plan should include a competent trainer to help you see your mistakes and move you forward with a different path.
I knew from the moment my horse got me bucked off that this was something different. I’ve ridden through bucking from high spirits and spooking even bucking through a flying change but my gut told me this was something else. And I knew I needed someone who has worked with hundreds of horses with all levels of issues from unbroke to rank and seriously messed up. So I asked friends whose opinion I trust who themselves have many years of experience with horses and they told me to work with the trainer I have now to restart my horse.
So far the results in the groundwork are satisfying and we will return to mounted work once the respect is re-established from the ground. My eyes are wide open so to speak and I am absorbing a whole new approach to the partnership I seek.
Excellent Post!!! I agree with much of what you said. I can’t say that I’ve seen a lot of people that became “overmounted” because they fell in love with a specific breed or color — but I don’t doubt for a second that they are out there.
What I HAVE seen are well intentioned people, even intermediately experienced riders that look for a horse, find one they like during “A test ride,” and then bring it home only to find it has a whole other range of problems they did’t know existed or feel prepared to deal with. ONE test ride, IMHO, does not tell you enough about the horse to be sure he is the right one – ESPECIALLY if you don’t have a lot of experience.
My boy was adopted from the track, but if I were to purchase a horse from a private seller, I would want to ride the horse a few times before agreeing to buy. Ideally, it would be best if I could take the horse on a trial period — but I know not a lot of owners are willing to do that — and I don’t necissarily blame them (if I were the seller, I would allow several rides to a potential buyer whom I think is really interested, but I don’t think I’d let someone take my horse to their house).
At any rate, a buyer should see the horse in a lot of different situations before buying. THEY should catch the horse, halter, bridle, and saddle it at LEAST one time if not more. They should ride the horse in the discipline they are choosing to pursue (i.e — if you are new to jumping and learning that discipline, buy a horse that has jumped before and not one that just has the “potential” to be a good jumper). The more visits a buyer can make before buying, the more sure they can be that this is the right horse for them.
What DOES annoy me and what I do see are a lot of are people that buy horses and have NO horse experience whatsoever. People who can’t even put a halter on or pick a hoof. Situations like this are sad — especially for the horses.
Now, I am not taking lessons as of right now due in part by issues I have with my self esteem and also because of finances. ….BUT I did take lessons when I was younger and worked for a variety of horse people. While I did not have good experiences with all of them, they did teach me things and I am grateful for that knowlege. Liking horses alone isn’t a reason enough to get one. At the very LEAST, get a friend or someone who can mentor you so you don’t get run away with because nobody ever showed you how to properly put on a bridle!
I also think that — plain and simple — there are some horses that just don’t get along with some people. My sister showed a horse in 4-H years ago who she absolutley loved. She had less experience than I and she got along amazingly with this horse. Every time I rode him, he bucked me off.. seriously…. I really didn’t like him and he knew it…and I think thats why we had some of the problems we did. My sister on the other rode him beautifully and did things with him that I wouldn’t have been caught dead doing. I truly believe that she just really clicked with this horse when I did not.
When talking about my own horse, I see it as a double edged sword at times. I am a big chicken s**t on the trail. I got run away with (when I was young and inexperienced) several years ago d an drd going on trail rides used to be torture for me. My palms would sweat just thinking about it. I have gotten to the point where I CAN ride on trails, but they need to be easy trails and preferrebly ones I am familiar with. I also ALWAYS ride with other people I trust…and that helps too. The ideal horse for me in this venue would be a bombproof trail vetran who has seen and done it all.
The problem with this is….that’s not what I want to ride at home. I am experienced enough to LIKE a challenge when I am at home in the familiarity of the arena. A bombproof horse would do nothing but bore me there. I am confident enough to get a horse “started” under saddle even — just don’t ask me to take him on the trail.
I can’t afford 2 horses, so I have one that is just challenging enough to keep me interested at home but not so bad that I am completely unwilling to work on my “trail nerves” with. Having 2 horses would truly be the best senario for me, but I don’t financially have that option, so I work with what I have.
Things HAVE gotten better for me and one thing I always tell myself is that it IS a work in progress with my trail nerves. Some days I’m really brave…and others are not. I’ve learned not to beat myself up when I’m having an off day and I think more people need to learn to do this….and to realize that it’s okay to admit you are afraid of something. The first part to working through it is to identify what “it” is and then take baby steps. Knowing what “it” is gives you a place to start….wether it’s being overmounted, loosing your nerve, being afraid of doing one exercise in particular….or just learning for the first time.
Sorry for the long comment
Sometimes I just get on a roll and run with it.
Once again….EXCELLENT POST, OTB….more people need to read this.
Hahaha that all sounds sooo familiar! A young horse that a trainer insisted the student buy, even though the student knew it was too much. And then the rearing, and then making it very hard for other people to ride that horse again. So yes, i definitely agree!! Another thing to consider is when i bought my young horse, i was an experienced rider but i had 1) never owned my own horse and 2) never really worked with a young horse consistently. Sure, i had ridden young horses and done well with them, but not owned one. It is a lot different riding young or problem horses in lessons, but owning one is a completely different story. And you cant buy a young horse thinking you will give it a few months of training with a trainer and then be on your own. You cant put a time frame on horses!! But a great post, and i hope you feel better!!
Great post! I think it really is more common than people think; heck, most of the people I used to ride for were just plain overmounted. It’s a hard subject to breach, but some owners would come straight out and ask me, “Do you think he’s too much for me?” In some cases, I had to say yes, and tell them why. Thankfully they were all pretty easygoing, and they trusted my opinion; some ended up selling their horses, while others half-leased them with more experienced riders, or simply entered a lesson program (with someone other than me) where they rode several days a week.
I admit I took plenty of lessons on horses with issues, mostly when I was too young to know the difference. But because I was working under the guidance of an experienced, compassionate professional, I never felt overmounted. But there’s a big difference between doing that when you’re 15, fearless, and still go “sproing” when you hit the ground, and doing it when you’re 35, just getting back, with a full-time job and family to look after.
I think being honest is the best thing anyone can do for themselves, and their horse. I knew a lady in her 60s-70s who adopted a 3y/o mustang when her old gelding passed away; after keeping the mare in training for a month or so, she finally admitted she had gotten in over her head, and upgraded to a teenaged steady-eddy who was perfect for her.
The biggest and easiest indication, which I always told my clients to ask themselves, was, “Are you having fun?” If you dread going out to the barn, it might be time to find another ride, even if it means selling and riding nothing but lesson horses for a while.
Interesting post. I mostly agree. I am slightly overmounted and readily admit it. I bought a 6 yo OTTB who had been off the track for 4 months. He is my first horse. He is very mellow, not at all the typical OTTB. However, I do realize that he is very green and I’ve been working with a very experienced, very reputable trainer ever since I got him.
I’ve had him for 6 months and wouldn’t trade or sell him for the world. He has made so much progress and my riding has improved tremendously. Riding my horse is a challenge that forces me to improve my skills.
I think my situation worked for two reasons. First, I’m realistic about my riding ability and was smart enough to get a good trainer. Second, I’m only slightly overmounted. I didn’t buy a completely wild horse with fantasies of taming it like The Black Stallion.
There are two things I disagree with about your post. First, I don’t think selling is necessarily the best option. If you’re overmounted, you have to ask yourself whether the situation is hopeless or if there is potential for improvement. Obviously, if your horse is a fire breathing dragon and you are an absolute beginner, yeah, you should probably sell. But if progress is possible, don’t you owe it to the horse to try and make the relationship work? I feel like I made a commitment to my horse when I bought him to see that he is taken care of and given the best life possible. If I give up and sell him, who knows where he will end up, especially if he has been deemed a “problem” horse or a “difficult” horse?
Second, I think that lesson horses can only take you so far. How do you learn to ride through a buck or a rear if you never ride a horse that bucks or rears?
I guess my point is that being slightly over mounted isn’t terrible if you’re willing to admit your own weaknesses and get help from someone with more experience. I think the trouble comes when people overestimate their skills and end up hurting themselves or their horse!
Very nice post, good information. You have a nice blog. I’m new to blogging, are there other horse blogs you recommend?
Evergreen
I have a lot of thoughts on this subject since I have lately found myself to be a bit over-mounted, but I’ll try to be brief!
- There’s a difference between over-mounted and challenged. It’s a really fine line.
- Even with several trial rides, it can be difficult to tell what a horse is really like, and you may not be able to test out a range of situations. You may also not really know what to test for. I bought my pony specifically to be a children’s walk/trot lesson pony. He is now in training to be a hunter/jumper and trail mount –a shift that wasn’t foreseeable when I bought him.
- One consideration which no one likes to talk about is the finances of the matter: in my case, I doubt I could sell my pony with his current rearing issue. He’s not big enough for most adults and definitely not safe for kids. So, even if I wanted to sell him, I don’t know that I could unless I sold him to be slaughtered or put down–I also don’t know how responsible it would be to sell him to another potentially overwhelmed rider (who might not have the training resources I do).
- My best advice: get to a busy barn with lots of help and other horses you can ride. And ride, ride, ride. Ride anything remotely sane you can get your hands on and ride into the level you need to be on to handle your horse. I was really frustrated when I was keeping my horse at a private farm and I was his only trainer. Now, I am still his only “trainer” but we’re in lessons at least once a week, I ride at least three times a week (and that’s in bad weather), and I also take lessons on and school other horses with a variety of temperaments to keep my own skills sharp/improve my skills.
- Finally, I hate to bring in a lot of shades of grey, but there’s also the question of how permanent the disparity is. Lucky (my horse) and I go through phases where I am not really able to “defeat” his challenges, but I stay on and just keep trying and eventually work through… to the point where I am a better rider and he is onto his next phase. Sometimes he actually feels too easy!
- The big concerns with being overmounted are safety and enjoyment. Whenever I feel myself thinking it’s a burden to ride my pony, I don’t ride him–I lunge him, I play with him, or I ride somebody else–and I get back in the mood quickly. I’m also at a really safe barn in that there are lots of people around and everyone is aware of my pony’s issues, so I get a lot of support from the community and never ride alone, etc.